[Rojhan]

Sure... Make me do some research...

49 CFR Part 567: https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2017-title49-vol6/xml/CFR-2017-title49-vol6-part567.xml

(3) “Gross Vehicle Weight Rating” or “GVWR” followed by the appropriate value in pounds, which shall not be less than the sum of the unloaded vehicle weight, rated cargo load, and 150 pounds times the number of the vehicle's designated seating positions. However, for school buses the minimum occupant weight allowance shall be 120 pounds per passenger and 150 pounds for the driver.

Of note, passenger and cargo capacities are independent. Which, puts me back to the "passenger + cargo" being informative/guidance/CYA by the manufacturer and GVWR/FAWR/RAWR being the controlling values.

 

[Len1304]

Sure... Make me do some research...

49 CFR Part 567: https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2017-title49-vol6/xml/CFR-2017-title49-vol6-part567.xml



Of note, passenger and cargo capacities are independent. Which, puts me back to the "passenger + cargo" being informative/guidance/CYA by the manufacturer and GVWR/FAWR/RAWR being the controlling values.

At the end of the day I’m going with Jeep saying 5000lb limit with 1000lbs people and cargo and tongue weight. Because I don’t like the idea of joe blow in a Cherokee driving down the road with tires under inflated at 6000lbs or more. We’ve all see that car or mini van rolling down the road and we all shake our heads.


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[Rojhan]

At the end of the day I’m going with Jeep saying 5000lb limit with 1000lbs people and cargo and tongue weight. Because I don’t like the idea of joe blow in a Cherokee driving down the road with tires under inflated at 6000lbs or more. We’ve all see that car or mini van rolling down the road and we all shake our heads.


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I was actually just trying to scratch the itch of "why don't the numbers add up." I'm satisfied with my answers.

As you've seen from my towing posts, I'm not recommending exceeding any limits, I was just looking for the "missing" 500lbs.

 

[Len1304]

I was actually just trying to scratch the itch of "why don't the numbers add up." I'm satisfied with my answers.



As you've seen from my towing posts, I'm not recommending exceeding any limits, I was just looking for the "missing" 500lbs.

I figured as much. No issue from me lol. I’m not one to talk about staying within the limits for weights. However, while I’m one to blow those limits out of the water I take steps to stay safe over them. I drive slower, over build my Jeep, etc.


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[Exiled_Addick]

Legally, my Jeep is overweight and that’s with only one driver and 1/4 tank of gas.

View attachment 192306


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Hi @Len1304


I know I'm picking up on an old post here, but I'm just getting into the whole minefield that is weight limits having bought just bought my first ever trailer. I thought I had it all figured out and was happy what I plan to haul shouldn't put me over any limits, but then I see this post. Have you made a lot of modifications to your KL? I'm curious how you can be over the front axle load with virtually nothing in the vehicle unless the vhicle is close to its axle limit dry, which seems unlikely?


I pick my trailer up at the weekend and plan on weighing everything at scale (if I can figure out where the heck the nearest one is - amazingly google doesn't seem to know), but I know I'm going to be at around 1000 to 1100 lb of cargo (including 400ish lbs of tongue). I expect that would keep me within the GWVR, but now you get me worried I;m going to exceed one of the axle ratings.

 

[Exiled_Addick]

Legally, my Jeep is overweight and that’s with only one driver and 1/4 tank of gas.

View attachment 192306


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Hi @Len1304


I know I'm picking up on an old post here, but I'm just getting into the whole minefield that is weight limits having bought just bought my first ever trailer. I thought I had it all figured out and was happy what I plan to haul shouldn't put me over any limits, but then I see this post. Have you made a lot of modifications to your KL? I'm curious how you can be over the front axle load with virtually nothing in the vehicle unless the vhicle is close to its axle limit dry, which seems unlikely?


I pick my trailer up at the weekend and plan on weighing everything at scale (if I can figure out where the heck the nearest one is - amazingly google doesn't seem to know), but I know I'm going to be at around 1000 to 1100 lb of cargo (including 400ish lbs of tongue). I expect that would keep me within the GWVR, but now you get me worried I'm going to exceed one of the axle ratings.

 

[Len1304]

Hi @Len1304


I know I'm picking up on an old post here, but I'm just getting into the whole minefield that is weight limits having bought just bought my first ever trailer. I thought I had it all figured out and was happy what I plan to haul shouldn't put me over any limits, but then I see this post. Have you made a lot of modifications to your KL? I'm curious how you can be over the front axle load with virtually nothing in the vehicle unless the vhicle is close to its axle limit dry, which seems unlikely?


I pick my trailer up at the weekend and plan on weighing everything at scale (if I can figure out where the heck the nearest one is - amazingly google doesn't seem to know), but I know I'm going to be at around 1000 to 1100 lb of cargo (including 400ish lbs of tongue). I expect that would keep me within the GWVR, but now you get me worried I'm going to exceed one of the axle ratings.

1000lbs (950 for TH) is the limit INCLUDING tongue weight. If you do not include tongue weight you will exceed the axle limit. At 1100lbs you’ll be over the maximum weight limit. Which I don’t recommend on a stock Cherokee. I’ve taken a lot of steps to upgrade my Cherokee to handle the weight. If there is an option out there, I have it. Lights, dual winches, batteries, rack, tires, tools, radios, wiring, gear. It all adds up one pound at a time.


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[Exiled_Addick]

Okay so now I'm confused again. Sorry, like I say, I'm new to towing. So GVWR of 5,500 - Curb weight of 4,000 lb (I don't have a TH) = 1,500 lb. I know the door sticker also talks about 1,000 lb max cargo, but there's a 500 lb disconnect there.


I'll be carrying 450 lb of passengers in the front, about 100 lb of passengers plus stuff on the back seat, a 120 lb dog in the trunk and a 3,500 to 3,800 lb trailer on the hitch (I'll be trying to keep the weight at the lower end of that range, the trailer is supposedly 2,900 lb dry). I know with the tongue weight at between 10 to 12% of trailer weight (keeping it below the max 450 lb) that all adds up to a bit over 1,000 lb, but still well below the 1,500 lb left when you subtract curb weight from GVWR.


So with that setup you think I will exceed an axle limit and why? Does my setup strike you as unsafe? Do I need to leave the dog at a friends when we go camping?


It really is a mine field, I don't know how they get away with advertising a 4,500 lb tow limit, when in the real world the only people who can do this would be supermodels who like to travel alone and keep less than half a tank of fuel in their vehicle.

 

[chartle]

As for a scale try this.

https://catscale.com/cat-scale-locator/?postalcode=&city=Edmonton&state=AB&miles=50&cmdSearch=

Also this.

https://www.google.com/search?q=you...9i57j69i64.14862j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

[Len1304]

Okay so now I'm confused again. Sorry, like I say, I'm new to towing. So GVWR of 5,500 - Curb weight of 4,000 lb (I don't have a TH) = 1,500 lb. I know the door sticker also talks about 1,000 lb max cargo, but there's a 500 lb disconnect there.


I'll be carrying 450 lb of passengers in the front, about 100 lb of passengers plus stuff on the back seat, a 120 lb dog in the trunk and a 3,500 to 3,800 lb trailer on the hitch (I'll be trying to keep the weight at the lower end of that range, the trailer is supposedly 2,900 lb dry). I know with the tongue weight at between 10 to 12% of trailer weight (keeping it below the max 450 lb) that all adds up to a bit over 1,000 lb, but still well below the 1,500 lb left when you subtract curb weight from GVWR.


So with that setup you think I will exceed an axle limit and why? Does my setup strike you as unsafe? Do I need to leave the dog at a friends when we go camping?


It really is a mine field, I don't know how they get away with advertising a 4,500 lb tow limit, when in the real world the only people who can do this would be supermodels who like to travel alone and keep less tan half a tank of fuel in their vehicle.

Okay. So from the factory our Jeeps weigh 4000lbs. We have a Jeep advertised and recommended cargo capacity (which includes fuel, people and cargo) of 1000lbs in your case. The extra 500lbs is a built in 10% leeway for calculation errors like carrying say 4 full grown maybe overweight adults and their luggage.

In my case, I have upgraded front springs, extra heavy duty rear springs, airbags inside the rear springs, 10ply load range E truck tires and upgraded brakes to handle all the extra weight I’m hauling around. Technically I’m overweight and could get a ticket. But unless I’m in a fatality accident or a DOT cop gets a spur up their butt I’m safe. Ive taken measures to compensate for the extra weight as best I can.

The reason I wouldn’t push the limit on a stock Cherokee is because the tires aren’t rated for it and the suspension can’t handle the weight. It’ll handle sloppy and the tires may be over capacity at max tire pressure because remember, the more weight you carry the higher your tire pressures need to be. Not to mention the factory brakes although good if you are towing a trailer and don’t have a brake controller or it’s setup improperly it won’t take long to cook them at that weight. I’m at 35,400 miles and have gone through 3 sets of brakes.

Until you go to a scale full loaded you won’t know for sure where your balance is unless you happen to have portable scales. Make sure to find a cat scale that you can measure each axle with and not just a total weight scale like at a dump.


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[Exiled_Addick]

Thanks for that - I googled every darn combination of truck, scale, weigh, station, house I could think of but couldn't find anything. Knew there had to be something up here!

 

[chartle]

Thanks for that - I googled every darn combination of truck, scale, weigh, station, house I could think of but couldn't find anything. Knew there had to be something up here!

To weigh your tongue this this.

https://www.etrailer.com/faq-how-to-determine-trailer-tongue-weight.aspx

 

[rdskill]

I know this is an old post, but I think people have the wrong idea of what happens when you exceed the limits on that door sticker.

Yes, you could be issued a ticket, but worse still... If you are involved in an accident while towing over the limits... kiss your insurance coverage for that accident goodbye. Your insurance company will deny you coverage. And good luck with tickets and lawsuits.