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If you didn't have me blocked you'd have the list of how the IBS works and how the PCM controls voltage but alas you still keep posting ambiguous information without any real data on it.

A KL is not going to have 12.8v while running unless there is an issue with the charging system.

My 4xe has "smart" charging and it NEVER is at 12.8v ever, but what would I know it's not like I don't play around with the electrical side of things all the time
 

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Discussion Starter · #102 ·
Yeah that 12.8V running is what catches the eye. Smart charging at work.
I have stopped watching mine lol. I did watch it some out of boredom on a recent 10 hour drive. I noticed when the kids had phones and IPad’s charging using a inverter it would hang around 13.1-13.8 a little bit but would mostly stay at 12.8. If it sits for 3 or 4 days it goes to 14.4 when started for about 5 minutes
 

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Discussion Starter · #103 ·
If you didn't have me blocked you'd have the list of how the IBS works and how the PCM controls voltage but alas you still keep posting ambiguous information without any real data on it.

A KL is not going to have 12.8v while running unless there is an issue with the charging system.

My 4xe has "smart" charging and it NEVER is at 12.8v ever, but what would I know it's not like I don't play around with the electrical side of things all the time
Well the people who built certain KL’s would disagree with the statement that 12.8v while running is a problem. It is funny that my Jeep charges just like the people who built it and designed smart charging said it should. Your 4xe does not have smart charging obviously. I don’t see how we can post actual factory documents of smart charging and you say it is wrong from your sample of 1. You are so hell bent on being correct that you refuse to accept the fact that supporting documents have been posted here to support smart charging. A KL with smart charging will run 12.8v a lot. You sir are wrong and it is getting old. Automakers do add features to vehicles over the years and change things up.
If you refuse to learn something new how did you learn what you know now?
 

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Well the people who built certain KL’s would disagree with the statement that 12.8v while running is a problem
Kind of like the same people that couldn't figure out how to properly tune the 9 Speed transmission, yet I could.
Kind of like the same people that programmed the KL's PCM to not provide the advertised power from the engine?

Documents are documents.....just like how jeep advertises the AWD system, it's wrong and was proven by myself with real world testing.
There is no programming in the PCM to support 12.8v while running, unless you want to direct me to the PCM programming that does?



Do you measure the IBS sensor to get real time voltage and current data from the charging system? If you don't then how can you be so sure about "certain" KLs have it.

Running voltage of 12.8v or close to that range is normal on vehicles with a second battery aka ESS equipped Wrangler JL's Compass/Renegade vehicles. Tell me which Cherokee KL's come with a second battery?
 

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Discussion Starter · #105 ·
Kind of like the same people that couldn't figure out how to properly tune the 9 Speed transmission, yet I could.
Kind of like the same people that programmed the KL's PCM to not provide the advertised power from the engine?

Documents are documents.....just like how jeep advertises the AWD system, it's wrong and was proven by myself with real world testing.
There is no programming in the PCM to support 12.8v while running, unless you want to direct me to the PCM programming that does?



Do you measure the IBS sensor to get real time voltage and current data from the charging system? If you don't then how can you be so sure about "certain" KLs have it.

Running voltage of 12.8v or close to that range is normal on vehicles with a second battery aka ESS equipped Wrangler JL's Compass/Renegade vehicles. Tell me which Cherokee KL's come with a second battery?
I was wrong about 12.8 volts. A Jeep Cherokee KL with smart charge mode can run 12.2-12.8 volts in Passive Boost mode. I got the Star report out again and it does not say that a second battery is needed for a Jeep to have smart charging. I would also note my Jeep charges exactly how the Star report describes and my charging system must be ok because I haven’t been stranding and we use the 12v power plug a lot with it not running.

I confirmed this by more than 1 dealer, driving multiple Jeeps like mine and documentation from Jeep. Heck when the tech took a ride with me when I had a issue he mentioned when I had it in for the battery and how he had not heard of it until then but has learned a lot about it now. I am done with this but just know a lot of Jeep KL’s will show 12.2 volts at idle and heavy acceleration and be “ operating as designed”. I can’t comment on the 9 speed because I am not that smart. I will not post on this forum again because your broken record approach to everything you already know defeats the purpose of a forum.
 

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Confirmed because you said so......so let's see some pictures and video of this behavior.....if your voltage shows 12.2v while driving there is a problem, your voltage should never go that low. I've watched videos of JLs with smart charging and their voltage never gets that low. Again we have a case of you saying something but not actually posting supporting documents. Weird my 2021 doesn't ever act like this
 

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Interesting so I read this thread yesterday so I decided to check my KL on the way to work and on the way home. 7 miles each direction. Stayed at 14.4v the whole time .
 

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@MikeR. Just did a video and sent It to me, 13.6v all the time, so again I'll make the statement show me a KL with a 12.2-12.8 Running battery voltage. The fact the "star" case mentioned here specifically shows Wrangler JLs shows that its for Wranglers and not KLs
 

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Discussion Starter · #110 ·
@MikeR. Just did a video and sent It to me, 13.6v all the time, so again I'll make the statement show me a KL with a 12.2-12.8 Running battery voltage. The fact the "star" case mentioned here specifically shows Wrangler JLs shows that its for Wranglers and not KLs
I was gonna let it go but now you have your video. Can’t wait to hear what you have to say
 

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I was gonna let it go but now you have your video. Can’t wait to hear what you have to say
Lots to say.........what about when you posted this

Well I just got back home with the Jeep. I took it on a 25 mile drive and it stayed at 14.4 volts running. I made sure it was charging before leaving the dealer.

on a side note I am freezing here in FL lol
So how come your battery behavior went back to what is normal for all KL's after you had parts replaced?

I'd like to see the service records and what PCM/BCM updates they did while replacing parts.

So you had this issue, replaced the battery and got normal behavior, then it started doing this.

I see the videos fine but this is not normal behavior for 99.99% of KL's built out there.

Here's @MikeR. video


The next logical thing to do would be to measure the battery current and see what the current (not voltage is going through the battery)

It's not harmful to have a 14+ running voltage to a battery when there is virtually no current going through the vehicle.

So again your vehicle does that, but you still can't prove it's smart alternator charging until you monitor the IBS voltage like this



So even though my battery voltage is "high" its giving hardly any current to the battery
 

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That behaves very similarly to my 2019 TH/E. Most of the time it's around 13.7 to 14.1 volts, but after the battery is fully charged it will bounce around a lot more. It takes a LONG time for mine to get in that state. Stomping the throttle gets it to go down pretty quickly, but again ONLY after things have been charging for a while.
 

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I have been monitoring the voltage in my Jeep. The charging voltage varies dependent on the outside temps. As it get warmer, the voltage will drop down from 14.4 to 14.0. When its colder, 40F and below, it tends to stay at 14.4v.
 

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I have been monitoring the voltage in my Jeep. The charging voltage varies dependent on the outside temps. As it get warmer, the voltage will drop down from 14.4 to 14.0. When its colder, 40F and below, it tends to stay at 14.4v.
Working as intended. Mine ranges from 14.4V in winter to 13.6V on warmer summer days :

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Built-in Temperature compensation for maintaining the set voltage output over the expected ambient temperature range

The regulated output voltage of the alternator is set normally to generate around 14 volts for vehicles using a nominal 12 volts system. This is to ensure that the alternator will be able to charge from a sufficiently higher voltage level even as the battery voltage keeps increasing with progressively higher levels of SOC. Apart from the alternator output voltage the battery’s capacity to absorb charge also depends on the rate of chemical reaction in the electrolyte. The rate of chemical reaction is dependent on the ambient temperature. The experience of the vehicle power system designers has been that the charging efficacy of the system can be improved by marginally modifying the set point of the voltage regulator to be more at colder temperatures and lower at higher temperatures; the aim is to compensate for the changes in the rates of reaction in the battery electrolyte by having an automatic voltage setting mechanism in relation to the ambient temperature. The alternators now have regulators with a temperature compensation circuit to dynamically change the setting of the regulator with respect to the ambient temperature. A typical graph showing the compensation is given in Fig 3.7 .

Sketch 3

Source :Automotive alternators – In-built safety and temperature compensation
 
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Working as intended. Mine ranges from 14.4V in winter to 13.6V on warmer summer days :

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Built-in Temperature compensation for maintaining the set voltage output over the expected ambient temperature range

The regulated output voltage of the alternator is set normally to generate around 14 volts for vehicles using a nominal 12 volts system. This is to ensure that the alternator will be able to charge from a sufficiently higher voltage level even as the battery voltage keeps increasing with progressively higher levels of SOC. Apart from the alternator output voltage the battery’s capacity to absorb charge also depends on the rate of chemical reaction in the electrolyte. The rate of chemical reaction is dependent on the ambient temperature. The experience of the vehicle power system designers has been that the charging efficacy of the system can be improved by marginally modifying the set point of the voltage regulator to be more at colder temperatures and lower at higher temperatures; the aim is to compensate for the changes in the rates of reaction in the battery electrolyte by having an automatic voltage setting mechanism in relation to the ambient temperature. The alternators now have regulators with a temperature compensation circuit to dynamically change the setting of the regulator with respect to the ambient temperature. A typical graph showing the compensation is given in Fig 3.7 .

Sketch 3

Source :Automotive alternators – In-built safety and temperature compensation
Or exactly like the PCM charging tables I've posted over and over again......
 

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Discussion Starter · #117 ·
Lots to say.........what about when you posted this



So how come your battery behavior went back to what is normal for all KL's after you had parts replaced?

I'd like to see the service records and what PCM/BCM updates they did while replacing parts.

So you had this issue, replaced the battery and got normal behavior, then it started doing this.

I see the videos fine but this is not normal behavior for 99.99% of KL's built out there.

Here's @MikeR. video


The next logical thing to do would be to measure the battery current and see what the current (not voltage is going through the battery)

It's not harmful to have a 14+ running voltage to a battery when there is virtually no current going through the vehicle.

So again your vehicle does that, but you still can't prove it's smart alternator charging until you monitor the IBS voltage like this



So even though my battery voltage is "high" its giving hardly any current to the battery
You are so big on proof I will need to see proof that 99.99% of KL’s do not have this feature. I will need build number by year, along with VIN numbers.
If I have used the battery a lot it may stay at 14.4 volts for 3-4 days, if it stays parked for awhile it may stay at 14.4 volts. I think the battery was not fully charged when it was installed so it took a few days to charge it.
It really blows my mind that I can support what my Jeep does along with a star report but you still say it does not have it. A forum is for learning and to find out new things, for some.
You keep showing me video’s of YOUR Jeep and that is great but I am telling you that after great effort I found out that some Jeep KL’s have smart charging. The only proof you can provide that they don’t is a sample of 2 and your opinion.
I really want you opinion on how my Jeep charges identical to the star report??

You sir do not like admitting when you may be wrong. I have been wrong a lot in my life but I don’t think I am with this one. I will be waiting for you to get hard facts on 99.99% of those Jeeps, you can just do the MY year 2020 and 2021.
 

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Oh no... this guy must have it all wrong too... ;) (see post #2)

From above post :
 

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Hey, Tyler is never wrong. Well, actually he thought he was wrong once, but he was mistaken. ;)
 
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