[Dodgeboy]

Two months ago I noticed my ESS was not working as frequently, then quit altogether with a 'Battery Charging' message on the display. I cleaned the battery terminals but that didn't help. With load tester, the battery tested OK but not by a lot.

Yesterday I was out running errands and the Jeep cranked slow and nearly didn't start. I took it straight home, checked the battery again and this time it just dipped into the bad zone on the tester. This is at 66,250 miles and a month under three years since new (I like driving this Jeep!). Can't complain but I would have liked to have gotten another year or two out of it.

I learned on this site (thank you!) that Advance Auto and Exide have good AGM batteries in the 94R size. Advance was $222 but my local parts store said they'd sell me an Exide AGM for $165. I thought that was cheap and it was. The counter guy made a mistake and it should have been $225, but he honored the price when I picked it up today.

I was expecting a two-handled, blue-topped battery like on the web sites but this had a black top and one handle. It is the right battery; rated 800 CCA and has a 48 month free replacement warranty, so they must have changed the style.

I pulled the old battery last evening and replaced it today so I was expecting error codes from the battery being out for about 18 hours. I got a few (4WD, Lane assist, etc.) but they all went away right after I started driving. The ESS still isn't working but the new battery has to charge a bit.

Incidentally, in the month or two when the ESS wasn't working, I didn't notice any drastic change in my gas mileage. No scientific study but I just watched the display. It stayed at 21-22 in mixed driving. I'm a big ESS fan but have to admit I thought it would make more of a difference.

 

[scotty9]

it may have to do with all the extras on these rigs or ,just a not so good battery like a bad one . i have used the walmart battery in my 406 for like 10 years now no problems an used them in all my cars had one last 7 years +,i hope to replace mine with a 700 cca over the 600 in there now,never had one fail before 4 years an that car sat alot,an cost alot less last time i got a 700 was like bit over 100.00 dated 2013 in my camaro ,price does not allways reflect how good the battery is

 

[Renthorin]

That's a drag. I get about 8-10 years out of batteries in my cars. Hoping my Jeep battery lasts that long too.

 

[Mark_]

Two months ago I noticed my Auto Start/Stop was not working as frequently, then quit altogether with a 'Battery Charging' message on the display. I cleaned the battery terminals but that didn't help. With load tester, the battery tested OK but not by a lot.

Yesterday I was out running errands and the Jeep cranked slow and nearly didn't start. I took it straight home, checked the battery again and this time it just dipped into the bad zone on the tester. This is at 66,250 miles and a month under three years since new (I like driving this Jeep!). Can't complain but I would have liked to have gotten another year or two out of it.

I learned on this site (thank you!) that Advance Auto and Exide have good AGM batteries in the 94R size. Advance was $222 but my local parts store said they'd sell me an Exide AGM for $165. I thought that was cheap and it was. The counter guy made a mistake and it should have been $225, but he honored the price when I picked it up today.

I was expecting a two-handled, blue-topped battery like on the web sites but this had a black top and one handle. It is the right battery; rated 800 CCA and has a 48 month free replacement warranty, so they must have changed the style.

I pulled the old battery last evening and replaced it today so I was expecting error codes from the battery being out for about 18 hours. I got a few (4WD, Lane assist, etc.) but they all went away right after I started driving. The Auto S/S still isn't working but the new battery has to charge a bit.

Incidentally, in the month or two when the Auto S/S wasn't working, I didn't notice any drastic change in my gas mileage. No scientific study but I just watched the display. It stayed at 21-22 in mixed driving. I'm a big Auto S/S fan but have to admit I thought it would make more of a difference.

Thanks for reporting in with the dead battery. I've been keeping track on the forum, not scientifically, but... just for kicks, and interest.

Yeah 3 years sounds about right, unfortunately, and you are way out of 3/36 coverage because of mileage. Those of us who live further North will get more out of these batteries, and those in warmer regions will get less.

It's a combination of bad battery placement under the hood (gets hot) and I'm guessing so-so battery quality.

I am very interested in this battery you've purchased. An AGM Exide with no double handles facing each other ? Haven't seen that yet...

Would you happen to have one or more of the following :
- A link to this battery you have now (any site will do)
- A part # (Exide battery number)
- Pics ? I know, once this baby is in and covered, it's too late...

Thanks...

 

[Dodgeboy]

Mark: I know you've been keeping track of batteries so I pulled the terminals and cover to take a couple pictures for the good of the group. Though it doesn't show, there was a tag on the side that said the manufacture date was 9/2017.

It seems the battery I have is the same part number as the blue top, double handled model. They must have made a running change.

Incidentally, the ESS started working again.after about 45 minutes of driving.

 

[Mark_]

Mark: I know you've been keeping track of batteries so I pulled the terminals and cover to take a couple pictures for the good of the group. Though it doesn't show, there was a tag on the side that said the manufacture date was 9/2017.

It seems the battery I have is the same part number as the blue top, double handled model. They must have made a running change.

Incidentally, the ESS started working again.after about 45 minutes of driving.

Well you did your homework and you are right, it looks like a brand new wrapping for the consortium's group 94R. I even checked the Exide site earlier and they are still showing the older case with blue top. I hate that they did this because it's just made my job a lot harder lol. We'll see as time progresses, if in fact other clones show up with this case and whether the facing double handle case disappears altogether. I have a few new visual cues with your case, and eventually/hopefully I can get side shots of that case as well (edit : not from yours, you've done enough, haha).

Oh and by the way I really appreciate you doing this for the forum, those connectors are not easy to tighen up...

Side note : while searching earlier, I noticed that Exide are now selling Northstars with their label, which is new as well ; they were identified as a Northstar distributor but, until now, had no Exide labeled Northstar on the market. The line is known as "Exide Pure Lead". I looked hard for models offered but it's difficult to find (for now). But those Northstar Exides have blue tops : https://www.exide.com/en/node/40966

FYI : CARiD sells the Exide group 94R AGMs for $166. which I hadn't seen before, so don't feel too bad for your local parts store : https://www.carid.com/2015-jeep-cherokee-charging-starting/?filter=1&manufacturers%5B%5D=Exide

Glad your ESS is back online. IIRC, others have noted the delay after replacing a battery, like you have.

 

[taatmk]

Mine quite at 3 years exactly to the month.....after replacement, things are back to normal and going well....

 

[Array]

.... I learned on this site (thank you!) that Advance Auto and Exide have good AGM batteries in the 94R size. Advance was $222 but my local parts store said they'd sell me an Exide AGM for $165. I thought that was cheap and it was. The counter guy made a mistake and it should have been $225, but he honored the price when I picked it up today.

With you being from PA, I thought you were going to tell us you got a Duracell Ultra Platinum AGM made by East Penn. https://www.batteriesplus.com/replacement/battery/duralast/94rdlg/sli94ragm. $216 with 10% discount, after core deposit refund and before taxes.

"East Penn Manufacturing has signed an exclusive agreement with Duracell ... to release batteries branded under the Duracell name. ... Two types of Duracell automotive batteries are initially being released, the extreme power AGM and the advanced generation EHP. Extreme power Duracell batteries offer premium AGM technology with two times (2x) the durability and dependability of a standard product. This high-performance line of batteries is ideal for multiple accessory power demands found in new vehicles or the extra drain of the many electronic devices that get plugged into the vehicle’s cigarette lighter. Advanced generation Duracell batteries are especially designed to provide superior life and maintenance-free performance. These batteries feature EHP Technology or Extra Heat Protection reinforcing it’s design to withstand today’s increasing under-the-hood temperatures or severe service conditions. This extra reinforcement also helps enhance its performance in colder weather conditions extending life in any environment." http://www.eastpennmanufacturing.com/east-penn-releases-new-duracell-automotive-batteries/. East Penn Canada too; used to be Power Battery Sales Ltd.

Problem with batteries is some things are so cryptic: i.e. not sure if the Batteries Plus battery includes the EHP technology. This is the build quality folks in the desert climates would find helpful.

Just replaced two BCI 31 chassis batteries in my motorhome that power up the Cummins ISL 8.9L diesel engine. They were Alliance batteries and lasted for eight full years. They hadn't quit, but there were hints of weakness I wasn't about to take a chance with after eight faithful years. Turns out Alliance is a Freightliner private label for Deka batteries made by East Penn. Trucking companies like these batteries due to solid construction and quality components able to withstand heat and banging around. Picked up two Deka batteries at a local battery store for less than the cost of Interstate batteries.

 

[Mark_]

With you being from PA, I thought you were going to tell us you got a Duracell Ultra Platinum AGM made by East Penn. https://www.batteriesplus.com/replacement/battery/duralast/94rdlg/sli94ragm. $216 with 10% discount, after core deposit refund and before taxes.

"East Penn Manufacturing has signed an exclusive agreement with Duracell ... to release batteries branded under the Duracell name. ... Two types of Duracell automotive batteries are initially being released, the extreme power AGM and the advanced generation EHP. Extreme power Duracell batteries offer premium AGM technology with two times (2x) the durability and dependability of a standard product. This high-performance line of batteries is ideal for multiple accessory power demands found in new vehicles or the extra drain of the many electronic devices that get plugged into the vehicle’s cigarette lighter. Advanced generation Duracell batteries are especially designed to provide superior life and maintenance-free performance. These batteries feature EHP Technology or Extra Heat Protection reinforcing it’s design to withstand today’s increasing under-the-hood temperatures or severe service conditions. This extra reinforcement also helps enhance its performance in colder weather conditions extending life in any environment." http://www.eastpennmanufacturing.com/east-penn-releases-new-duracell-automotive-batteries/. East Penn Canada too; used to be Power Battery Sales Ltd.

Problem with batteries is some things are so cryptic: i.e. not sure if the Batteries Plus battery includes the EHP technology. This is the build quality folks in the desert climates would find helpful.

Just replaced two BCI 31 chassis batteries in my motorhome that power up the Cummins ISL 8.9L diesel engine. They were Alliance batteries and lasted for eight full years. They hadn't quit, but there were hints of weakness I wasn't about to take a chance with after eight faithful years. Turns out Alliance is a Freightliner private label for Deka batteries made by East Penn. Trucking companies like these batteries due to solid construction and quality components able to withstand heat and banging around. Picked up two Deka batteries at a local battery store for less than the cost of Interstate batteries.

When I click your link I get $239.99 with a $12 core deposit (??)

I'm reading that differently :

"East Penn Manufacturing has signed an exclusive agreement with Duracell ... to release batteries branded under the Duracell name. ... Two types of Duracell automotive batteries are initially being released, the extreme power AGM and the advanced generation EHP<snip>"

I see that as : the one they are showing to be the Extreme Power AGM. So which battery out there has EHP ? Good question...

One thing I can almost be 100% sure about : that Duracell in your link (Batteries+) is a 94R AGM consortium clone, just like all the others, including the OEM Mopar 94R AGM. Wish I were wrong..

But boy those heat defying AGM batteries sound good for sure !

 

[Array]

When I click your link I get $239.99 with a $12 core deposit (??)

I had to put it in a cart to comprehend their pricing:

$240
-$24 10% discount
---------------
$216

After core deposit refund from store
Free shipping
Price before local taxes

 

[Array]

.... I'm reading that differently : I see that as : the one they are showing to be the Extreme Power AGM. So which battery out there has EHP ? Good question...

Good point. Appears to not be made for group 94R.

https://www.driveduracell.com/pub/media/wysiwyg/Duracell_Spec_Sheet.pdf

Wasn't there another group you all identified would fit in the KL? Wonder if that group is in the list of EHP batteries from the above linked sheet?

 

[Mark_]

@Array : okie-dokie... they are making it difficult to view a price. Too bad. Like I said up there, the bargain right now is with CARiD (Exide 94R AGM for $166).

This consortium has really changed the game. Not that long ago there were battery manufacturers that stood out from the crowd with above average products, like Deka, East Penn, Odyssey, the old Optimas, etc... Nowadays, most of these players got together with Johnson Controls with this new consortium. Not all their products are produced via the consortium, so some of their batteries are still unique, niche batteries. One of the problems is that they are not making information about this easy to find (if available at all). I'm convinced they have non disclosure agreements piled up. My guess is that certain battery types, perhaps even some specific models were pooled to reduce production costs and enhance profit. The group 94R clones stood out because all those great - formerly independant battery manufacturers - were suddenly all selling the same battery in this specific group/application.

One last example, check out this "Deka" group 94R : http://www.ebay.com/itm/DEKA-GENUIN...nking-Power-/332062907928?hash=item4d507dde18

The eBay description throws "920 Amps" up front, but that's not the CCA number. Read way below and you see right away this is the same ol' clone (800 CCA, 140 min RC...). And yeah the signature facing double handles... which I will miss, haha.

 

[Array]

.... One thing I can almost be 100% sure about : that Duracell in your link (Batteries+) is a 94R AGM consortium clone, just like all the others, including the OEM Mopar 94R AGM. Wish I were wrong..

Sneaky is the code word. However, the Batteries Plus Duracell has the same name and specs as the East Penn battery from the linked list. So if one were to buy into the quality/history of the East Penn products versus the general consortium clone bunch....

???

 

[Mark_]

Good point. Appears to not be made for group 94R.

https://www.driveduracell.com/pub/media/wysiwyg/Duracell_Spec_Sheet.pdf

Wasn't there another group you all identified would fit in the KL? Wonder if that group is in the list of EHP batteries from the above linked sheet?

Oh sorry...I was taking my time replying to your other post and didn't see this one until now...

Yeah... well, under the EHP listing, only the smaller group 48 would fit in a KL. Group 48 is the OEM size for the 2.4L KL. Not as wide as a 94R, relatively lower CCA and RC ratings. But... if they stand up to the heat, they could prove to be serious contenders...

I will try to research those a bit more...

 

[Array]

@Array : okie-dokie... they are making it difficult to view a price. Too bad. Like I said up there, the bargain right now is with CARiD (Exide 94R AGM for $166).

This consortium has really changed the game. Not that long ago there were battery manufacturers that stood out from the crowd with above average products, like Deka, East Penn, Odyssey, the old Optimas, etc... Nowadays, most of these players got together with Johnson Controls with this new consortium. Not all their products are produced via the consortium, so some of their batteries are still unique, niche batteries. One of the problems is that they are not making information about this easy to find (if available at all). I'm convinced they have non disclosure agreements piled up. My guess is that certain battery types, perhaps even some specific models were pooled to reduce production costs and enhance profit. The group 94R clones stood out because all those great - formerly independant battery manufacturers - were suddenly all selling the same battery in this specific group/application.

One last example, check out this "Deka" group 94R : http://www.ebay.com/itm/DEKA-GENUIN...nking-Power-/332062907928?hash=item4d507dde18

The eBay description throws "920 Amps" up front, but that's not the CCA number. Read way below and you see right away this is the same ol' clone (800 CCA, 140 min RC...). And yeah the signature facing double handles... which I will miss, haha.

My original thought was driven by the EHP heat resistance and supposed East Penn build components and quality. When it's my turn to buy a battery for the KL, I'll probably go for the savings considering the sneaky nature of these products. (I doubt this has leaked into the commercial truck market?)

 

[Mark_]

My original thought was driven by the EHP heat resistance and supposed East Penn build components and quality. When it's my turn to buy a battery for the KL, I'll probably go for the savings considering the sneaky nature of these products. (I doubt this has leaked into the commercial truck market?)

We were kinda posting at the same time up there.

My observation was that the facing double handle 94R AGMs are all consortium clones. All of them.

Now those EHP East Penns may not be consortium produced... and could very well be unique to East Penn. And who knows, they could be an awesome battery for the KLs.

I'll try to find more info on them... but no promises

 

[Mark_]

Hmmm. Seems the East Penn EHP Duracells have been around since - at least - January 2011 :
http://racerpr.com/news/2011/01/19/...l-automotive-battery-of-the-super-chevy-show/

I've tried to find more info online, but I get practically nothing. Seems like they went nowhere with it. I'd think that if they had something, folks in the South would have caught on to it by now.

And just to add a layer to the clone story : looking up East Penn batteries shows them to be East Penn - Deka. Remember the Deka 94R AGM clone from eBay ? Hahaha.

 

[Dodgeboy]

When Array asked if I had gotten a battery from East Penn, I took a look at Google Maps to see where that company is (about 50 miles away near Reading). I didn't see anything named East Penn/Deka, but did notice that the East Penn address is on Deka Road. A clue! :wink:
There's also a Deka Factory Battery store right nearby. If you plug 102 Deka Road, Lyons, PA into Google Maps, you'll find a big industrial complex right in the middle of farm country. One of the buildings is East Penn Manufacturing and the one next to it is the Deka Industrial Building.

Here's a link to the Google 'Street View' of the sign in front of the complex: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.477...bHWNRotC6kg7rVw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?authuser=0

 

[Array]

Hmmm. Seems the East Penn EHP Duracells have been around since - at least - January 2011 :
http://racerpr.com/news/2011/01/19/...l-automotive-battery-of-the-super-chevy-show/

I've tried to find more info online, but I get practically nothing. Seems like they went nowhere with it. I'd think that if they had something, folks in the South would have caught on to it by now.

And just to add a layer to the clone story : looking up East Penn batteries shows them to be East Penn - Deka. Remember the Deka 94R AGM clone from eBay ? Hahaha.

Too murky for me .

After some more browsing, it became clear EHP technology is not an AGM battery, which explains why it's not available for group 94R but is available for group 48 used in the 2.4L.

FWIW, I bumped into this recent list of manufacturers and brand names: http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/batbrand.htm.

 

[Mark_]

Too murky for me .

After some more browsing, it became clear EHP technology is not an AGM battery, which explains why it's not available for group 94R but is available for group 48 used in the 2.4L.

FWIW, I bumped into this recent list of manufacturers and brand names: http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/batbrand.htm.

You want murky ? :grin:
There are non AGM 94Rs out there : https://www.walmart.com/ip/EverStart-Maxx-Lead-Acid-Automotive-Battery-Group-Size-H7/20531542

There are AGM group 48s (consortium) : [ame]https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-48AGM-Professional-Automotive-Battery/dp/B008FWCLHU[/ame]

Yeah, I know...

I looked at that battery manufacturer list last night as well while I was searching for the link I previously had for the consortium, which has curiously evaporated. Or it's just me doing the search wrong because there are thousands of hits now on a recent battery consortium move on Li-ion batteries.
That list does not address the consortium's impact on the industry ; every manufacturer appears to do its own thing, but they don't... Well they do, for products not shared within the consortium. Merky you said ? :laugh:

And you're right about the EHPs not being AGMs. Then again, we know AGMs aren't much better in the heat, so I had some hope that this *new* EHP thing (which isn't new at all) would possibly offer some hope. It was probably all just a marketing gimmick on a not-so-great product...

Edit to add : just FYI on the cheap CARiD Exides I talked about earlier ; well, both the 48 AGM ($158) and 94R AGM ($166) are listed as *Out of stock*. Figures...